app][lick.ation][end.age on Thu, 5 Sep 2002 14:21:52 +0200 (CEST) |
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Re: <nettime> oh, the gents they do protest too much! |
dear coco, firstly, i'm presuming that after yr generic reply 2 several postings addressing elements of yr "modest proposal for josephine bosma" post, that u'd prefer 2 utilize a general correspondence pattern rather than direct response engagement. i'm by-passing this by choosing 2 [attempt 2] engage u [& others] in a direct forum x.change. At 01:21 PM 31/08/2002 -0400, u wrote: >Too all those nettimers who appear to have been irritated by my modest >proposal: .....in actuality i wasn't irritated by yr post, but more n.trigued|puzzled. >It is quite enlightening and amusing to discover that the protagonists of >a milieu that is famous for its irreverence toward anything considered >established, its ironic attitude toward anything purporting to represent >"truth", and its propensity for parasitical caricature, would be so very >sincere, so incredibly earnest, and so absolutely righteous in their >responses to a parody of the "scene" they are a part of. Apparently, it's >fine to lampoon everything from multinationals to medecine as long as the >holy temple of alt.net culture remains untouched. ...secondly, coco, a request 2 u b4 i begin 2 pursue a genuine reply - i'm becoming confused regarding yr communication _n.tent_; at the moment this puzzlement stems from various inconsistencies in yr dialogical approach.....u seem quite content 2 illustrate yr points with (failed satirical) references that endorse the m.plied pedagogy status of 2 dead _white_ _western_ males [one b.ing skakespeare (via yr allusion 2 the paraphrased hamlet quote in the subject line) & the other b.ing swift (yr reference 2 satire below)] whilst denigrating any valid form of participant|multilogue response .... ....i'm also curious regarding if u intend 2 elaborate past this satirical continency? do u choose 2 participate in forums such as these in order 2 x.punge information regarding political|interpetative|analytical leanings only ie present a 1-sided critique that offers no hope of unfolding via considered discussion? i do realise yr expository tracts r not destined 2 b absorbed through an _intent_ filter alone, coco, but it is x.ceedingly difficult 2 attempt cogent responses 2 yr assertions whilst this satirical-recourse-call is in constant (potential) operation..... >It is also quite >endearing to find that so many men have rushed to the aid of damsel Bosma >- hence, I must conclude that chivalry is not dead in the realm of the >posthuman, but humor appears to have evaporated! Herr Cramer, I'd say that >if you are perceiving uptightness, it might be coming from the reflection >in your mirror, as it seems you cannot take a joke when it's on you! .....again, these constant generalisations regarding the practic][ition][e][rs][ of net art/wurk/forums act only 2 legitimize pat][hie][riarchic|cloistered methodologies of "the other" by yr consistent reliance on the lecture-form rather than participating in sustained dia|multilogues.............yr pin.pointing of the males that responded again acts 2 negate|over.write any females that _also_ responded [again surprising given yr ideological stance]........ >For those who apparently have not read Jonathan Swift, the Irish colonial >satirist whose spirit and title I borrowed, I highly recommend his >brilliant and hilarious tracts that artfully poke fun at the piety and >hypocricy of the British. He's a great avatar, I'll say that. ...i'd prefer if u could recommend a non-male, non-white, non-western satirist as a more relevant x.ample, as this would seem 2 b more consistent in terms of yr assertions [and corresponding lament regarding non-discussion of such categorisations b.low]................... >My main point, for those who had trouble discerning it on their own, was >that Bosma's opinions were based on rather ludicrous, reductionist >descriptions of the works she glossed over in her review. One could >approach net.art in the same way, as I did, and the resulting appraisal >would sound quite disturbing to those who felt themselves the object of >such a critique. Bosma's attitude toward the artists and curators was >arch, ignorant and at times even racist. Ah yes, that terrible word. But >nearly every time any non-white subscriber to this list makes an >assessment of anything posted as being racist, that non-white subscriber >is attacked -- by white, leftist, progressive, activists and theorists who >embrace nomadism and deterritorialization but refuse to examine their >prejudices or their own relentless need to micromanage all opposition to >official discourses about people who have been deterritorialized and >subjected to racism in Europe and America. We're dealing with is about a >political project of territorial control. Doesn't matter to me if that >territory is physical, intellectual or artistic. Hence, a parodic approach >was a good tactic in such a repressive milieu. ...i agree that a *productive* parody would b effective. howeva, yr attempt at satire doesn't operate anywhere near a successful level, with its constant wavering b.tween hodgepodge critique & humourless character ridiculing .....also, claiming satirical n.gagement with objectionable (u term it racist) material only further acts 2 reiterate the nature & _content_ of the material under treatment, s.pecially given that no alternative n.ceptions of such material r ][pr][offered by u, coco.....u r actively perpetuating this _repressive milieu_ . this unfortunate continuance, in turn, acts 2 muddy any n.teresting concepts u raise in this highly conflicting confab............. >I have no doubt that Transmediale juries wade through zillions of >applications. I have sat on dozens of such juries in my lifetime and have >done the same - and know from experience it is in no guarantee of >democratic procedure, or that the final selection will reflect a range of >tastes or provenances - it usually just becomes a statistic that festivals >can boast about (" Wow we are so omnicient that we reviewed 2 million >applications in our search for the best of whatever...." ). Any good >shopkeeper in a European city would know that a pastiche tray of goodies >from around the world will sell - as long as nothing on the tray BITES THE >HAND THAT FEEDS IT. Thus the number of entries reviewed, Herr Andreas, >does little to alter the insularity of the milieu, the cliquishness of the >scene, the narrowness of its aesthetic views, or the obsession of its >proponents to restrict their view of the history of avant garde new media >to the last ten years, (tossing in an occasional and unusually inaccurate >reference to some early 20th century European avantgarde.) There was new >media, intermedia, activist media and electronmic media before The Next >Minutes and before nettime -- and alot of it continues without having any >contact with this milieu. .....i'm x.tremely n.terested in x.panding my knowledge base regarding arenas that predate & run parallel with a net.based environment...could u perhaps say more regarding this, coco? >I find it quite symptomatic that the high priests of No Border >consciousness, posthuman subjectivity, and new media chic always seek to >trash postcolonial theory and dismiss the art they consider to flow from >those ideas. The same European leftists who believe they have the solution >ot the "refugee problem" are the ones who do everything possible to force >the expressions of refugees, exiles, immigrants and their offspring in the >domain of intellectual discourse and art practice through their >CHECKPOINT. Those who step around that BORDER are condemned to be exiled >from the temple. We didn't pass quality control, oops. How come you don't >like us anymore when we leave the refugee camp and get college degrees and >speak your language(s)? Why might this be? Is it really about theoretical >weaknesses of postcolonialist thinkers (whose ideas are rarely discussed >in depth - all that I ever see here are blanket statements about >"postcolonialism" as if it were singular)? ..also, i'm keen 2 learn further about these postcolonial thinkers.....can u give a rundown of some individuals that differ in their portrayal|participation in this singular, monochromatically-defined .ism? >I doubt it. None of you who >have responded have demonstrated enough openness, sensitivity, >understanding or respect for anticolonialist struggles or postcolonial >intellectual and cultural production for me to think for one minute that >you know something significant about them. .....i'm also keen 2 learn just how yr satirically-m.bued response pattern encourage][d][s open, sensitive, respectful communication? or, in contrast, how u've procured yr immunity 2 this response pattern via yr preemptive knowledge|affectivity structures? >The resistance to any >discussion of institutional racism in alt.net culture adds to my >skepticism. Forget about dealing with the outrageously obvious racist >psychodynamics of internet porn and "artsy" erotica. That's another can of >worms. .........coco, do u perceive that yr use of anglomanic|westernised x.position as a legitimate method of discourse [via a practical validation of it as yr primary communication tool] is perplexing in relation 2 yr points x.pressed above, & that this could further alienate any legitimate _PoCo_ vocality that u seem keen 2 portray yr theory [& self] as embodying? ....yr proposal unpacks as a dreadful manifestation of a imperialistically-tinged dynamic [1 that surpasses the quasi-satirical & plunges straight in2 a progressively victim-discrediting|orientation structure, again hi-lighted by yr generalised naivete-of-response tone] that u criticize with such vigor above........... .....please feel free 2 respond 2 my observations above, coco [& all], & i look 4ward 2 potential unfoldings beyond these largely ornamental + contradictory textings, mez [aka app][lick.ation][end.age] . . .... ..... collapsing adj[thr]usting.txt . . app][lick.ation][end.age www.cddc.vt.edu/host/netwurker/ http://www.montevideo.nl/www/english/current.htm .... . .??? ....... # distributed via <nettime>: no commercial use without permission # <nettime> is a moderated mailing list for net criticism, # collaborative text filtering and cultural politics of the nets # more info: majordomo@bbs.thing.net and "info nettime-l" in the msg body # archive: http://www.nettime.org contact: nettime@bbs.thing.net