<nettime> venezuela digest [bello, schaefer]

["nettime's_strongman" <nettime@bbs.thing.net>]

"Ricardo Bello" <aracal@well.com>
     RE: <nettime> Venezuela: reply to Ricardo Bello
franz schaefer <schaefer@mond.at>
     Re: <nettime> Chavez - What Reality are We Talking About?

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From: "Ricardo Bello" <aracal@well.com>
Subject: RE: <nettime> Venezuela: reply to Ricardo Bello
Date: Tue,  9 Mar 2004 13:22:54 -0800

Brian, sorry if I can't answer very long today, my mother is
in an Intensive Care Unit in Caracas, she is pass mortal danger
now, but not to well, and I have been unable to check my email
as I ussualy do. However, just a few lines. Look at this posts,
I wrote them around April 2002, I checked them out after reading
you ("One can observe that in 2002 there was a failed coup led
by a man from the business elites - which I recall you applauding
pretty enthusiastically at the time"). Brian, I do not applaud
racist and violent opposition, I have fougth them by peaceful
means, and still do. I wrote this (posted somewhere else, but
still, it's good to remember):

"I may agree with you with "POVERTY is the genocide of the poor",
but there is something weird in all this, and Stratfor doesn't
get it. The worst type of marginalization is not suffered by
the economic outcast, but by the political one. These people,
those extremely poor woman who
live in slums with no health care whatsoever, no food and no
job, never were citizens in the first place. They never were
taking into account and with Chavez, for the first time in their
lives or her ancestor's memories, they feel (they do not think,
the relationship with political
power is not a rational one) for the first time in 200 years,
as citizens, members of a society or community. They can conspire
now (an excellent definition of community would be something
like this: two or more people willing and able to conspire),
they act on history. The present exists. They are poor but they
are
real.

This is the big issue and most anti-chavistas do not see the
picture. Many people, everything points that way, are going to
get killed this year. We have been so far a more or less pacific
society, an exception in Latin America: Guatemala, Colombia and
El Salvador were distant
scenarios. Both sides of the conflict do not want to see the
face of the opponent, the political alter-ego; they do not want
to see that face, it's too troublesome. Politics of recognition
is an absent area in our symbolic interchange. We are the invisible
people, the
non-existent one, the forever outcast enemy.

Economic welfare goes second place, it isn't even an issue in
the political agenda."

I wrote this in nettime:

http://amsterdam.nettime.org/Lists-Archives/nettime-l-0204/msg00162.html

http://amsterdam.nettime.org/Lists-Archives/nettime-l-0204/msg00098.html

Best,
Ricardo





>--- Original Message ---
>From: Brian Holmes <brian.holmes@wanadoo.fr>
>To: nettime-l@bbs.thing.net
>Date: 3/8/04 12:12:57 PM
>
One can observe that in 2002 there was a failed coup led by a
man from the business elites - which I recall you applauding
pretty enthusiastically at the time - then a crippling shutdown
of the oil industry by its managers, conceived to bankrupt the
state and force a regime change (it was billed as a workers'
strike: pretty easy to 
obtain when you lock the doors of the production facilities).

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Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 01:52:32 +0100
From: franz schaefer <schaefer@mond.at>
Subject: Re: <nettime> Chavez - What Reality are We Talking About?

> Indeed, very beautiful words, but while Chavez gave his speech,
> the National Guard was killing and detaining people so they couln't
> deliver a message to the international press. It's all very sad.
> Propaganda works sometimes.

keep in mind: the USA have just spent about 60 G$ (giga = 10^9) or more for
the war on iraq to get some cheap oil and a good geo-strategic position in
the middle east. now how much cheaper is it to buy a few "protests", finance
some violence... a few agent.. with only a tiny fraction of that buget.. say
1% or even 0.1% you can buy a lot of "resistance"... you can finance a lot
of media lies... plus: the bourgeois who has a lot to loose from a just
distribution of wealth and large capitalist media will be on their side
without any need for extra money...

you can buy a lot of "reality" for that amount of money... i am not into
conspiracy theories but it would be just plain stupid if they spend so much
money on the one side and nothing a single dollar on the other side.. where
sucess is much cheaper...

do you know first hand what you are talking about or was it just on one of
the 20 capitalist TV channels? and even if you would have seen it with your
own eyes: how would you know that the people who have been arested are not
CIA agents?

mond.

p.s.: i do not have any "first hand" information myself.. but i can count
2+2 together..

-- 
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   .                Franz Schaefer         GPG KeyID: CFA2F632
  ..         NEU: +43 699 106 14 590    Fingerprint: 57C2 C0CC
  ...             schaefer@mond.at         6F0A 54C7 0D88 D37E 
    ...          http://www.mond.at/       C17C CB16 CFA2 F632

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