tbyfield on Thu, 8 Nov 2018 16:44:11 +0100 (CET) |
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Re: <nettime> Fascist "trolls," meta |
On 8 Nov 2018, at 14:25, jan hendrik brueggemeier wrote:
just to reiterate: AB was an alt-right hack of nettime? times certainlyare changing ... (apologies for the slow response).
I'd rather spend time on just about anything but Bard, but on this point:
As far as I know, Bard's been on the list for many years, going back at least to the Tulipomania conference in 2000, when he was programmed in a debate with (my, how times have changed!) Richard Barbrook and Michael Gurstein. Personally, I think that Bard is "alt.right" and a hack, and it's a fact that he was on nettime, but to suggest he "*was* an alt-right hack of nettime" — no. That invites a level of conspiratorial thinking that's unjustified and unnecessary. I think the last time anyone suggested someone else on the list was part of some hidden plot to target nettime was 20 years ago, probably almost to the day. Let's make the next time it happens in November 2038. If this list should be about anything at all, it should be about advancing some kind of freedom in understanding how individual, collective, and mass beliefs and actions coincide. Conspiratorial implications that cast others as instruments of hidden agendas do the opposite.
That said, in a few private mails after being modded Bard made a few remarks that, in my view, confirm hat his ideas have aligned with the extreme elements of the alt.right — for example, something that sounded a lot like the "white genocide" bombast common in supremacist circles. That put an end to whatever reservations I had about modding him — not because those views are proscribed on this list, but because there was no reason to think he'd be able to engage in constructive debate. He also asked to unsubscribed, which he was. So: he's gone off to the happy hunting ground of, as he put it, "the Intellectual Deep Web." But I don't want to say anything more, because it isn't fair to discuss someone in a public context where they can't reply.
More generally, a few people have pointed out on- and off-list that open forums where people from across the political spectrum can exchange and debate ideas are desperately needed — as an ideal in their own right and for pragmatic reasons, because the alternative is a world of intellectual inbreeding, feedback loops, and closed systems.
If this list needs anything (and it desperately does), it's to expand the range of voices and ideas, not to narrow them and turn inward. So I'll repeat this:
You know what would be great? If we — by which I mean all of you, acting individually — could take a few concrete steps to nudge this list in better directions. Rather than make a few banal suggestions of things you can do *right now*, as if this were a political fund-raiser, it's better to leave this as a standing invitation.
Cheers, Ted # distributed via <nettime>: no commercial use without permission # <nettime> is a moderated mailing list for net criticism, # collaborative text filtering and cultural politics of the nets # more info: http://mx.kein.org/mailman/listinfo/nettime-l # archive: http://www.nettime.org contact: nettime@kein.org # @nettime_bot tweets mail w/ sender unless #ANON is in Subject: